One of the couples who are plaintiffs in the lawsuit in their engagement photograph.
Last week, three couples filed a federal lawsuit against the state of Virginia for requiring couples applying for marriage licenses to disclose their races. They claim it violates the 1st, 13th, and 14th amendments, and is emblematic of a racist past and not belonging in the present day. Virginia is one of eight states that requires couples to provide their race. In some counties, racial categories included outdated terms such as "octoroon" (being 1/8 black).
However, the Virginia Attorney General decided this week to not enforce that requirement. This is a victory for the couples, but they are still proceeding with their lawsuit because it is still a law on the books and they want it declared unconstitutional.
I personally am glad that this is being removed. I do not feel like there is any important enough need to require race to be mentioned for marriage licenses, because it is absolutely not necessary. I was shocked by how outdated some of those racial forms are, and it could appear extremely demeaning to potential applicants.
This case, if it goes far enough, could set a very interesting precedent on to what extent race can be present in forms and if it can be a determining factor in the acceptance of said forms. This relates back to Loving v. Virginia, the Supreme Court case that ruled that banning interracial marriage was unconstitutional. It could be a modern-day equivalent.
Questions:
1. Do you believe that any state should require disclosure of race on forms, even if it is not a determining factor in the acceptance of those forms?
2. Is this law constitutional or unconstitutional? Why?
1. Do you believe that any state should require disclosure of race on forms, even if it is not a determining factor in the acceptance of those forms?
2. Is this law constitutional or unconstitutional? Why?
3. Will this set a precedent for other states with similar laws to change their laws?
This is a past relic that shall be removed, just like Confederate statues. While I am almost confident that Virginia will not restrict interracial marriage again, just like I am *almost* confident people will not worship Robert E. Lee again, such a question is simply odd. Whenever we're filling out a form and encounter a question asking for race, our knee-jerk reaction is asking why. So why do marriage licenses require disclosure of race? Because it's an irrelevant question from (more) racist times when interracial marriage was banned, and we didn't bother deleting it. Deleting rid of it only clears suspicions and saves time. One less question for thousands of couples! To streamline society, we must cut down on flubber like this.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Kai in that asking for the race of someone is a completely irrelevant question. However, while it is an unecessary question, I believe that states should be allowed to put that question there, as long as a "decline to answer" option is provided. This is because there may possibly be some cases in which the race of the person provides statistical value, such as in polls or in surveys. In my opinion, the law stating you must declare your race when obtaining marriage licenses is unconstitutional. The Civil Rights Act of 1964 prohibits discrimination on the basis of race, and asking for someone's race could possibly be used in discriminatory methods that may not be disclosed to those who are filling out the forms.
ReplyDeleteI believe they shouldn't ask about or for you race at all on any documents and college apps; because,they creates an insane bias not for the person applying but the person that is accepting these college applications.
ReplyDeleteI agree with everyone above that states should not require couples to disclose their race on marriage licensences, but I think keeping the question on marriage licensences is important because they provide data on the population of the US and states that could be important in the future. Like the national census that occurs every 10 years, this is just another way to collect data. I think that if the couples are not required to answer the question on their marriage license, the law is constitutional because the people are perfectly in their right to decline to answer. I don’t think that this case in Virginia will have much carry over or influence on other states because this issue didn’t get much national attention and other states are free to have their own policies.
ReplyDeleteStrictly speaking, the law is not unconstitutional because there is no discrimination being enacted through the requirement to fill out your race; in the case that a state adminstration is using racial data to discriminate against interracial or non-white couples, then it would be unconstituitonal. I can see a use of asking couples to fill out their race (for the purposes of statistics for criminal justice systems). However, I understand why filling it out their race is uncomfortable for those who do not feel that their ethnicity is properly represented in the limited selections, and think that filling out one’s race for a marriage certificate should not be legally required by states. I believe this would influence other states with similar laws to consider changing their laws, but I am not sure how soon a change would occur given that states may consider other issues as more pressing.
ReplyDeleteEarlier, Nathan mentions keeping the question to acquire data about the population. I don't really think this is a valid argument, given that we have other methods for official censuses that are much more cohesive than asking a few people applying for marriage licenses. The way Virginia structured it, it's more of a racial barrier than any sort of well-intentioned collection of data. And while this may not necessarily be explicit segregation, there's an implicit bias in the people who are collecting the applications for marriage licenses and the state itself that requires these. If it wouldn't change their opinion, then why would it be there? It may not be actually unconstitutional, but it should definitely be removed.
ReplyDeleteI think that it is extremely disrespectful in modern day culture, especially being raised in the bay area for the disclosure of race to be required to apply for a marriage license. Mariage is a practice to which loved ones may participate in to devout their passion for each other. It has nothing to do with race or nationally. Although this factor may not be used to determine acceptance of the license, some couples may be sensitive to this topic. Instead the process should focus more on questions that ensure a healthy relationship. I don’t believe it necessarily violates the first or thirteenth amendment, however the fourteenth amendment does come into question. American customs and societal relationships have evolved dramatically since the constitutions were written. I believe such requirements should be removed from the marriage license process for all states.
ReplyDeleteRace being a factor is definitely just a factor for having a barrier. Marriage is a sacred topic for many people, and I feel that asking for race is a bit uncomfortable for such a formal thing. There does not seem to be any purpose for having had such a requirement in the past. If there is any implication of bias, I feel that such a requirement should be removed. Constitution should not always be a deciding factor if something is just overly uncomfortable and not very useful to anyone.
ReplyDeleteIf race has no relevance to the form, then there is no reason for it to be included, plain and simple. Forms which require race for no reason are just a holdover from a time in our country where race was an all-too-important factor. Getting rid of these holdovers is an excellent step forward. Though it is not likely that other states will take this lead automatically, this case is a good indicator that people themselves are taking notice and will force states to change their regulations in the future.
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ReplyDeleteNo state should require the disclosing of race so people can receive a marriage license. Race, much like sexuality, should not be a factor anyone is concerned with when it comes to marriage. I believe any law requiring the disclosure of race in order to obtain a marriage license is unconstitutional. I hope the lawsuit goes well and the law is defined as unconstitutional in order to set a standard for the other 7 states who also require the disclosing of race for marriage licenses.
ReplyDeleteAnother shot in the dinosaur's leg is fired, adding towards its inevitable collapse. It is good to see a lawyer alongside the couples who will stop at nothing until the statute is eliminated. I feel that the "Decline to answer" option on the marriage form is a good start, but it is not enough. If an engaged couple were to select this option, then the people processing the form will be suspicious. The right to privacy is a confusing issue, and it's hard to say if asking the question is unconstitutional. I do hope this inspires more change, and I look forward to seeing the statute's eradication.
ReplyDeleteNo state should require anybody to disclose their race. Someone's race/identity should be their choice to spread. Forcing people to disclose their race violates someone's right to privacy. Adding on, the law is unconstitutional because as you mentioned, it violates the first, thirteenth, and fourteenth amendments. With this said, the law should automatically be declared unconstitutional. Regardless of race or ethnicity, people should be treated equally. Someone's race should not be important to the federal government, but rather national issues that should be worked on.
ReplyDeleteI think that people should not have to disclose their race if they don't want to. Marriage between people of different race is not illegal, so there really is no reason for passing a law that requires race disclosure in the case of marriage. As race had always been a factor of possible bias, it should not be reported this way. They could include this question but they should let people choose freely whether or not they want to answer it. Many people feel uncomfortable sharing their race because they know discrimination and bias exist. It think the removal of the law in Virginia would make other states to think reconsider their law enforcement related to similar cases.
ReplyDeleteI do not think race needs to be accounted on any marriage license for any reason. I find that there is no real necessary reason for the government to know the race of two people being married. I do agree with what others have commented on its use for surveys, polls, and other statistical information, but besides that there does not seem to be a use for that information. I think as a society we have progressed far enough to look past race as any sort of insightful information. To reflect this, removing the question off a marriage license should be implemented. Also considering the fact that the question remains dated on forms is quite disrespectful. Having options, like you mentioned “octoroon,” can be more offensive that informational. For these reasons, I find that the question does not serve any purpose on marriage certificates.
ReplyDeleteI do not believe that states should be allowed to require a disclosure of race on marriage forms, especially if it is not a determining factor in the acceptance of the forms. Disclosing race is an anachronistic requirement that has no place in modern society and if it has no bearing on the outcome then there is no reason to have it in the first place. Though outdated, it is not technically unconstitutional as the federal government has no law that contradicts it. If other states have laws like this one, then removing that requirement will set a precedent for those states to remove those laws.
ReplyDeleteIn my belief, I do not believe that states ought to require the disclosure of race on marriage documents is absolutely necessary, but there can be reasons for why that it is the case. For example, the information could be documented in order to track the state ́s demographics, etc… Nonetheless, I believe that this law is constitutional as its intent (from what I can tell) is not racially motivated, and the state of Virginia has deemed this information as an important aspect of the marriage license. Moreover, if other states wish to focus upon this aspect, then other liberal states would likely follow suit in the sense that this may promote racial equality.
ReplyDeleteStates should not require couples to disclose their race on these form because I don’t believe that race should matter in this situation regarding obtaining a marriage license. Knowing the race of two married people serves no purpose to the government or state besides informative data such as others suggested, further supporting the fact that race is not needed in obtaining a marriage license. If race is something that is required to be documented in the forms, I believe this law to be unconstitutional. Moreover, this requirement indeed violates their right to privacy by forcing them to disclose personal information. However, if stating their race was an optional part of the forms, I would consider this law to be constitutional in that the people are given a choice on whether or not they will choose to disclose their race.
ReplyDeleteI personally feel as though it is completely unecessary for states to establish a mandate that all couples should be required to disclose their race in order to obtain a marriage license. This inherently violates a citizen's right to privacy and furthermore suggests that a certain bias is being placed on distinct races. There is no restriction whatsoever that limits or prohibits the intermarriage of different races. If companies or cooperations do ask for one's race, it should solely be for informational purposes and no advantage should be given to seemingly superior races. However, I do beleive that if people do not wish to disclose their race, they should have a right to not answer as it is confidential information. Forcing people to expose their race is inherently unconstitutional, however allowing that option of choosing whether or not they wanted the company to be aware of their race, should be available to all. The selection or discolsure of races should in no way affect the outcome or result in which the person is endeavoring to achieve.
ReplyDeleteSimilar to the sentiments of the others that have commented, I do not believe that requiring couples to disclose their race is a good thing. I suspect that this will not be a case in which this requirement is found to be unconstitutional. However, this does not mean that requiring the disclosure of one’s race should be allowed. Although other comments have cited the possible use of this information in polls, I cannot imagine that this information would be of much use because this data is only collected in eight states, severely limiting the scope of what this data can reveal. Even if this requirement leads to good polling information, I find it obscene that words like “octoroon” are used to describe people today.
ReplyDeleteThere is no reason for race to be included on the form, unless it holds some sort of importance. But, in this case, asking for your race in order to receive your marriage license is an extremely irrelevant question. However, while this question is somewhat unnecessary, states should be allowed to present this question only if there is an option to not answer this question. This is because this information may be needed for statistical value in some cases. This law stating that you must declare your race is unconstitutional, in my opinion; although, the right to privacy is a confusing issue.
ReplyDeleteNo state should include any form based off race. There really is no determining factor about a marriage license. People should be able to get married regardless of race. I also think that it is unconstitutional because it can potentially be used to support racism. Couples can occasionally be denied the marriage license. This shouldn't happen however states have the right to ask these questions. The government should make a uniform law so that the states don't ask a lot of personal questions and make it easier for couples to get a marriage license.
ReplyDelete